tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post2313454290140205067..comments2024-02-20T16:10:31.948-07:00Comments on First Nerve: The Pendock Paradox: What If Perfumes Were Wine?Avery Gilberthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18104017679971839738noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-76270711994771607732010-03-24T17:35:56.708-07:002010-03-24T17:35:56.708-07:00i love the weirdness of luca turin.
he was the fir...i love the weirdness of luca turin.<br />he was the first figure i was confronted with in this world.<br />he's like moby in the music world.<br />i find him fascinating in his ability to be opinionated in a not relevant way. <br />and i love that he is central to so much discussion.~x~https://www.blogger.com/profile/03096258576176694623noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-77151248371628469972010-01-04T20:22:25.560-07:002010-01-04T20:22:25.560-07:00Anonymous:
"Somewhat narcissistic." Heh...Anonymous:<br /><br />"Somewhat narcissistic." Heh.<br /><br />I got a similar impression second-hand reading Burr's worshipful account of Turin. From my review:<br /><br /><i>Burr portrays Turin as a Goethe-like polymath, a brilliant, intellectually restless,<br />self-educated aesthete. He has a doctorate in physiology but “picked up chemistry on his own”, along with physics. He’s held appointments at research institutes<br />in France, Russia, the USA and England. Turin is a vivid conversationalist, capable of invoking the Situationists, Noël Coward and Wagner in an anecdote about why he disliked elementary school. We learn that Turin is a sharp dresser and vain about his appearance. He bores easily. His favorite Sauternes is the 1981 Château Lamothe Despujols.</i><br /><br />The whole thing is <a href="http://averygilbert.com/Downloads/Gilbert%20-%20Emperor%20review.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a>.Avery Gilberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18104017679971839738noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-75997011360039056232010-01-04T18:10:02.290-07:002010-01-04T18:10:02.290-07:00I think we all agree that that 'Perfumes, the ...I think we all agree that that 'Perfumes, the A-Z Guide' is far from the be all and end all of perfume reviews and should be taken with a salt mine sized grain of salt. I admit to owning this book and read it purely for the snarky comments.<br /><br />Their introduction exhorts their readers to 'believe your nose only' and they claim to smell/review all fragrances blindly, thus supposedly practicing what they preach.<br /><br />I, however, would like to call bullshit on that. I am only a hundred or so pages in, but there is no logical explanation for the frequent {and nauseating} tongue baths lavished upon a certain trio of perfumers. If one were, for example, to look at various painters or architects, I would posit that not every single one of their paintings or buildings was a home run.<br /><br />Witness what Gehry did to his house: http://www.greatbuildings.com/cgi-bin/gbi.cgi/Gehry_House.html/cid_1042767014_Gehryhouse.html <br /><br />Throwing a chain link fence on top of your house - really ??<br /><br />While I hold that trio in great regard - they ARE incredibly talented perfumers - there is just no way EVERY SINGLE fragrance they ever created was worthy of 3+ stars. Thus far, LT begs to differ.<br /><br />LT also seems to have an odd fascination/obsession with Yohji Homme ... repeatedly calling other fragrances derivative thereof. Bourdon's Coolwater ... I wholeheartedly agree - that fragrance was mind-blowingly original and DID spawn countless knock-offs/twists. But Yohji Homme? Can't say I've ever heard of it. And it's been discontinued. Was Coolwater ever discontinued ? I rest my case.<br /><br />The book is also somewhat narcissistic ... " while living in Paris"," while vacationing in Corsica", this fragrance reminds me of "my stepfathers 1954 Bentley Type R" blah blah blah.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-80752204584502597632009-12-23T14:50:31.930-07:002009-12-23T14:50:31.930-07:00What if perfume were wine...well they are not!
I ...What if perfume were wine...well they are not!<br /> I am very fond of Luca and Tania and even thou I do not share their opinions in many of their fragrances reviews or tastes, Luca did what many would dream of doing: he made people want to know about perfume, he made people want to read about them, write about them. He opened a new door for everyone.<br />Once you buy THEIR book, you expect to hear from THEM, what THEY feel about this or that perfume. As subjective and as bitchy as they can be.<br />Blind samples? What for? The product is not just the juice itself. it is the bottle, the package, the idea, the concept, the face and the juice.<br />Nobody expects Luca or Tania to recognize fragrances like trained monkeys. Nobody is giving Luca and Tania a grade or their skills on recognizing this or that perfume.<br />One does not wish to have a book full of technical contents but to read what THEY feel when THEY smell this or that fragrance. It is a teaser to take your butt off the chair and go to the next perfume store to check what YOU feel about the fragrance. if you agree with them or not. The idea is to go smell it and make your own review.<br />About his skills, Luca does not need to prove he knows what he smells. we all know he does!<br />besides, just for you all know, once my husbbie worked as a bar tender and gave a famous wine critic a wine Y saying it was X brand (and it was not), the guy did not notice. When my husband confronted him and his skills, he said he had a cold.<br />So, I think that wine critics or commentators should stick to wine. Otherwise they will also start teaching about the sense of smell instead of Drs. Like Avery Gilbert....+ Q Perfume Bloghttp://www.maisqueperfume.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-55864686713795287942009-12-22T01:13:52.579-07:002009-12-22T01:13:52.579-07:00http://www.perfumebynature.com.auhttp://www.perfumebynature.com.auAmbrosiahttp://www.perfumebynature.com.aunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-25556582258107488522009-12-22T01:10:41.576-07:002009-12-22T01:10:41.576-07:00What a fascinating concept! I can't stand most...What a fascinating concept! I can't stand most perfume reviews. Being a professional perfumes myself, I know how little they have to do with the actual scent and how rarely they actually even get close to describing the perfumes they are written about.<br />(And don't even get me started on modern perfume advertisments claiming ingredients such as rose and violet in concoctions which have never even come near the actual flowers themselves...)<br />I'd love to hear your review of my perfumes, which would definitely be a blind test as my little company isn't very famous or french ...<br />Would you like me to send you some samples? if so email me your physical address!<br /><br />Ambrosia<br />ambrosia@perfumebynature.com.auAmbrosiahttp://www.perfumebynature.com.aunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-22066602395410733282009-12-21T19:01:11.896-07:002009-12-21T19:01:11.896-07:00If even physics is subject to an observer effect, ...If even physics is subject to an observer effect, why not perfume reviews? There is no way to rid any kind of review of subjectivity, as others have pointed out, so instead why not recognize and appreciate the varying notes and accords (I apologize for the language) and see the field as basically discursive. When art is reviewed, it is reviewed as a work or group of works by this or that individual, for example, Monet, Kahlo, Picasso, etc. The artist is seen as intrinsically valuable to what is being reviewed; his "signature" or "style" or "presence" is an inherent part of the piece (I realize there are exceptions to every rule but would argue for the overarching point of view here.). In time, he or she builds up an oeuvre and new works are reviewed in comparison to that oeuvre in terms of whether they break out of the mold, elaborate it, or lie stagnant within it. Why not treat perfume and its reviews in a similar way. Luca Turin's insults were just that - insults, not measured, well thought out commentaries or sensual attunements to the perfumes he was evaluating. Most readers are able to see this fact and find it either humorous, offensive, immature, or the rantings of a narcissist. Some consensual validity is able to be reached about his affronts. In this way, the wider readership is able to apply some criteria to a review. <br /><br />I am not in the industry. I am a clinical psychologist in private practice and a lover of scent in all its forms. I read reviews and enjoy them, especially when they are not blind.Marlenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02059534609134490054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-59816326952207417502009-12-21T12:17:38.833-07:002009-12-21T12:17:38.833-07:00C) I appreciate the idea of smelling perfumes blin...C) I appreciate the idea of smelling perfumes blind—but how you do that, I’m not quite sure. Perhaps send theperfumedcourt $100 a month and tell them to send random stuff marked only “A” and “B” with a key to connect the vials to the names after you’ve tried them.<br /><br />But while wine is often tasted blind, for the average consumer, the name, vintage, memories, etc., will always be powerful elements making (subjective) contributions to one’s enjoyment. (Just ask Margaux Hemingway who was famously made after her parents finished a particularly good Chateau Margaux.) After all, there are no good wines, just good bottles, the saying goes.<br /><br />That said, as an amateur reviewer, I do try to set on one side what I smell and on the other what I know about a scent before I smell it. An imperfect system, yes, but at least it’s a conscious one. <br /><br />What I like about reviewing perfume is the opportunity to make those connotations, those connections—some imposed upon me by the perfume maker, others by my own experiences. <br /><br />Another quiz: which would you rather smell: a) “LadyBoy,” or b) “Sandalwood”? Which would you rather read/write about?<br /><br />Finally:<br />D) You can’t hope to like everything a critic likes; you can’t hope to make every connection that a reviewer connects. But you can enjoy the writing (subjectively). I understand your call for less “personality” or ego or snark or whatever in perfume reviews: you would like to see perfume reviews, in general, be more “objective.” However, it is noteworthy, and I say this not as an insult or an accusation, that one of the things that makes your own site worth reading is your strong voice—you are quite the snarkasaurus yourself, you know. <br /><br />But yes, I take your point—how do you like your perfume reviews? “Fume porn”? Snark-fests? Straight up? Maybe there’s room enough on the Interwebs for everybody. Here’s hoping there are enough reviewers, and enough readers, to go around.<br /><br />-RitaThe Left Coast Nosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10102549295051352579noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-25200198322615140002009-12-21T12:17:05.040-07:002009-12-21T12:17:05.040-07:00Avery, this is a very interesting posting, one tha...Avery, this is a very interesting posting, one that warrants a fuller conversation, which I’ll take your invitation to continue here:<br /><br />At the heart of this posting you are fundamentally asking: what does a reviewer do, and how/if/can we rate how well s/he does it? In a nutshell, I’m here to argue that we that the business of reviewing is always subjective, and here’s why:<br /><br />A) Parker is an interesting reviewer to discuss because, he is, of course, so hugely influential, with the power to make winemakers either very rich or damn them to obscurity. He’s achieved this critical clout by pioneering methods for removing bias from wine tastings, his refined palate and his reputed olfactory/gustatory/experiential memory of over 100,000 wines. However, all that doesn’t put him any closer to a “well-defined and consistently applied criteria” than “What Robert Parker likes is what Robert Parker likes.”<br /><br />And while it is worth noting that while a maker of French Bordeaux, California Cabernets, and Rhone Valley wines must hang on his every word, Parker was pretty much laughed out the business of reviewing French Burgundies. So even the almighty Parker has limits as a tastemaker. The wine community has reached a consensus that his opinion is valuable (within his specialties), but his power as a make-or-break wine reviewer is <i>collective</i>, not objective. (We haven’t made a machine to tell us what we like—not yet, anyway.)<br /><br />For the purchaser of wine, if you like what Parker likes, well then, you are going to pay more for wine both you and he find tasty. However, if your sensibilities don’t align with his, all those 100 point ratings are useless to you, other than saving you a bunch of bucks. No matter how "objective" or "subjective" the reviewer, if you don’t have some alignment with his/her sensibilities, then their rating (“90 points;” “five stars out of five”) is of limited usefulness.<br /><br />B) If there is no guarantee that one’s sensibility is in agreement with a critic, then what else does the reviewer have to offer his/her reader? A <i>reason</i> to try what s/he likes: out of the vast raft of movies to see, restaurants to patronize, wines to drink, or perfumes to sniff, why this one, rather than that one? Not just that you like it--what is the edge, the story, the hook?<br /><br />Here’s a pop quiz:<br />To those who are new to mid-20th century classics—if you could only pick one to try, which one would it be?<br /><br />a) Diorella<br />b) Diorling<br />c) Diorissimo<br />d) Dioressence<br /><br />The correct answer is a) Diorella. That is because Brother Burr writes that it smells like “a new fur coat that has been rubbed with a very creamy mint toothpaste.” And while I’ve read plenty on the other Diors, what they smell “like”, I can’t say. <br /><br />You don’t have to agree that you smell mint paste+ fur coat too (which I don’t); and, you don’t have to like it (but I do). But his description, his connotations <i>do</i> make Diorella the one I want to know better.<br /><br />(To be continued...)The Left Coast Nosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10102549295051352579noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8125354955146250762.post-45959488792777288832009-12-20T22:21:00.374-07:002009-12-20T22:21:00.374-07:00After posting my review, I received an e-mail from...After posting my review, I received an e-mail from Luca Turin "I saw in your article that you mentioned I never answered your email, so let me do so with a belated apology. No, we did not smell perfumes blind."Neil Pendocknoreply@blogger.com